Industrial SMPSs from Phoenix

[more10]

http://eshop.phoenixcontact.se/phoenix/assets.do?action=techdata&artnr=2866682&general=sesv

http://eshop.phoenixcontact.se/phoenix/treeViewClick.do?UID=2938222&parentUID=852324142&reloadFrame=true

I cannot find any information on switching frequencies.

Are they useable?

Would be cool to build DIN rail amps :-)

[V-bro]

Usually DIN rail SMPS are very noisy... They are not at all designed for audio purposes...

[more10]

Usually DIN rail SMPS are very noisy... They are not at all designed for audio purposes...


Residual ripple < 80 mVPP (with nominal values)

Is 80 mV too noisy? I have no experience whatsoever in these matters :-).

[V-bro]

That's almost a tenth of a volt, that's pretty noisy if you ask me... But the Tripath amps do have rather high "power supply rejection ratio" Or "PSRR", I'd have to do some math to see where this starts to have influence.... Perhaps others have digged in to this and can say?? Jan can tell for sure....

[FFF]

Well, this seems clear about PSSR: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_supply_rejection_ratio
So, I would not even worry about a ripple of 1V (on the main power-supply, not aux.voltages)
1V=1000mV
But noise is different than just the ripple. I suppose noise (et al) on a smps is about the switching spikes and the like.
So noise is (should be) listed next to ripple.
However, much more important for those aux.voltages.
And I believe the ripple is even a lesser issue on a switching amp, hence the high PSSR on these amps.
But hey, some use batteries (just DC) for absolute perfection.

With TAA4100A, the datasheet states: PSSR=60dB @ 14,4Vdc, 200mV ripple, 1kHz
So, 80mV ripple (@ 10A here) then is not an issue. TA2020 is even better.
For TA2020, TA3020: can't find it, but think even higher.

I think it is more important that the PS can keep up with the amp; should be able to deliver when required, whatever the design.
But, yes, a linear PS is usually more quit, goes without saying, but smps is small+light....(usually)..and pretty good.

About that Phoenix SMPS: it seems to be a professional, high grade SMPS. To be used domestic, medical, light-industry.
For medical it has to be pretty good? So it does not interfere with sensitive equipment.
Protection is IP20, almost none. (vingers, water). Can give 13A, and 60A for 12ms.....load reg +/-1% is good.
For what power amp would one need this ?!?
And what IS the (high) cost of it?

I think real industrial SMPS's are used for machinery or charging big batteries (forklift). 5-500KW range.
For that business, they don't give shit for load reg. or noise (or sound-noise). (seen them)
Those are definitely NOT for audio.
It is often the reason that a radio (with aerial antenna) in a heavy industry environment tunes+sounds like shit.

So many words again.....

[V-bro]

Well, normally you can assume a certain degree of influence when the input frequency on the supply voltage is within the audio band, which isn't usually the case with an SMPS. But some do run under 20Khz and then I would stay away from using it at all.

Then there is the possibility of the modulator going nuts from higher frequency power supply ripple...

[FFF]

Well, you seem to have good measuring equipment on the job.
Maybe you could run some smps tests (noise, ripple, freq.), on dif. smps's; idling, max load.
Biggest prob. is maybe a test load resistor. And time. And if you feel like it.
So very maybe.

I have smps's:
- a cheapo, 24V
- a meanwell type 350W, ~24V
- a HP 180W, 19.5V; laptop
- a cheapo, 24V
- a 90W, 19.5V; laptop
- a 70W, 18.5V; laptop
- a 36W, 12V
- a 15W, 12V

[V-bro]

I need a high precision audio analizer and an amplifier adder... The latter is fairly simple to make, but the first is expensive equipment...

A simple DMM and scope won't do to preform these measurements precise enough....

[FFF]

I was thinking about what you did/use with those EMI tests.
But then you would need to do it in the evening there, in your spare time. If any.

However it would solve some questions, instead of talking or assuming.
I only have a scope.
Maybe some day? (but I won't have all those smps's available all the time)
PS
I can hold all those in 1 hand. Impossible, weight-wise, with linear.

[FFF]

Talking about measuring equipment:
http://cgi.ebay.com/2Msps-Sampling-Rate-ARM-DSO-Nano-Pocket-Oscilloscope-/190466403499?pt=BI_Oscilloscopes&hash=item2c58aeacab

Micro-digital-storage scope.
Not great, but very nice to have! For $75.=50-60 Euro (Better version coming for $199)
Just 1ch, but looks nice, compact, gives useful info. Will do for a lot of stuff to check.
With a X1/X10 probe.

If I had NO scope, I would be tempted.

[V-bro]

Nah, that was a spectrum analizer... Not usable here...

But yes, they are light those SMPS, I have just received the Coldamp SMPS board. Only negative thing I can mention is that it won't fit in a 1U high box by default, but after changing the caps you are 1mm away from it. It's still the transformer... But I decided to lower the floor a bit with spacers...

[FFF]

But that's just what we want to know: the spectrum of signals being cranked out by the SMPS?
As compared to a linear PS

Nice, getting new stuff in.

and yes, just ignore my micro-scope. sniff.

[V-bro]

It's not the right tool for this believe me....

The micro-scope looks cool, but also lacks precision for serious measurements. If you totally lack a scope it could be handy though...